Rai Munir

Musk Man
Respected Members,
Request for your valuable opinions. What is the real difference (or what does create difference) between essential oils and artisanal oils? Is it the quality of wood or distillation techniques or adulteration of oils that plays a vital role or are there some other factors?

I thank everybody in anticipation.
 

Habz786

Resident Artisan & Ouddict Co-Founder
Its a number of factors but the main thing is the smell. Today i smelt many oils, oils which people praise but im hard to please lol... I smelt many oils and said pass, its ok or good or no thanks. If an oil isnt stunning it doesnt impress me and thats how i define whats artisinal to whats not. A ok or good oil doesnt satisfy the crave, of course wood quality and distillation play a big role as well as ageing but the end factor is the scent and what it does for you.
 

Rasoul Salehi

True Ouddict
My 2 cents

For me when the oils carry a signature of time, place and method. Meaning artisanal oil "cuz" should not just be a beautiful oil but one that is typical (in wine we call it typicite as in the French word) of its origin and can be a flag bearer for oils of its kind. E.g if it is maroke it shouldn't smell like Thai or Hindi. After this it needs to fit the profile of an oil made from the base material that distilled speaks of and also true to the technique used. E.g if a is common belief that copper distilled or low temp distilled oils have "abc" and "def" character, then an artisanal oud made in that method should carry that stamp. Lastly the signature of the distiller is noticeable.

In another way of explaining it: in my humble opinion artisanal oils are intellectual exercise and deduction can be used to get to the truth about them in a blind testing format (when the wearer doesn't know the origin of an oil and has to use deduction to derive at it). It is not good enough for me to see these oils smelling fantastic. But they should carry typicite and on top the X factor and wow factor.
 

Rasoul Salehi

True Ouddict
@Habz786
It honestly really really depends on the oil and also is not entirely fair to do so off applicator. I find once on the skin and after a few hours my success rate is over 80%. S just going off a feeling not actual metrics. Sometimes a bit better sometimes a bit worse. But to me hovering around that 80+% is significant and tells me that there is truth behind the oils. Most of them at least.

I do blind test oils off applicator and vial every single evening. Randomly reach to my stash and or get my lovely wife to pick 10-15 dif oils of around 100 and I go to town with closed eyes and start detective work :)
 

hasans1412

Resident Artisan
I for one have never been interested in Art per say, so take my thoughts as such. From what I see, the basic sense is that the one who creates something can be called an Artist. A perfumer can call themselves an artist when they create perfumes based on their character and memories. In terms of essential oil where different distillers can get the same results if they follow the norm, an artist in that sense perhaps is someone who innovates in that matter away from the norm to achieve something different. Nonetheless, to me it’s just good Oud vs not so good Oud, and good Perfumes vs not so good Perfumes (and not to forgot some bad ones...haha).

At the same time, I do understand people with an interest in Art will approach such things in a completely different manner than me, and that is expected.
 

Rai Munir

Musk Man
Well, respected Rasoul and respected hasans 1412, wood, distillation and 'art' are the elements you mentioned. Okay, fine. But the question still persists 'what makes oil smell different?'. I am no artisan, so it is difficult for me to understand the matter. Scent profile is different. It is obvious. Artisanal oil distiller is actually an artist. Well, one who distills essential oils considers his distillation an art. I am trying to get the core cause/ reason. You people are well-versed in this field. Your sharing would definitely be functional and instrumental. @Al Shareef Oudh Jawed and @Bengal Roots Zak are fully involved in creative art of agarwood distillation. I feel they can make me understand in no time.
 
From Wikipedia:

Shokunin is a Japanese word for "artisan" or "craftsman", which also implies a pride in one's own work. In the words of shokunin Tashio Odate:

"Shokunin means not only having technical skill, but also implies an attitude and social consciousness... a social obligation to work his best for the general welfare of the people, [an] obligation both material and spiritual."


Hold-on!:hand:
:Cautious::Sneaky:

My view on Artisanal oud is...No Artisanship:eek::eek::Cry:

I just think that "Creative Distillers" or "Creative Distillation Directors" should be the proper term.

I believe that we have consumed many of their "Experiments":confused:

But from their efforts we also tasted some wonderful oils:Inlove::Inlove::Inlove::thumbsup:

With this criteria in mind, it would be difficult to identify an oil as Artisanal or Essential:Thumbsdown:

But if we were to appreciate the efforts of a particular distiller, then, identifying their signature is what sets his or her oils apart from other distillers, or if you must, Artisanal from Essential:Whistling:
 
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Respected Members,
Request for your valuable opinions. What is the real difference (or what does create difference) between essential oils and artisanal oils? Is it the quality of wood or distillation techniques or adulteration of oils that plays a vital role or are there some other factors?

I thank everybody in anticipation.

Dear @Rai Munir The different are artisanal choose the materiel (wood quality) & methods of cooking & soaking & choose the skillful distiller...
 

hasans1412

Resident Artisan
But the question still persists 'what makes oil smell different?'
Well, there are many factors that can or will effect the results (the aroma), just like any science experiments. For examples the type of woods, the soaking time, the temperature...etc. Weather changing each specific factor in a certain way improves the aroma in a certain way or degrades it in a certain way, that is the question. And for that you need to experiment a lot...and even then each batches of woods are different. And even then, aroma/ smell is a subjective measure.

On your other point, it really depends on how you view Art and your love for it. For example, some of the classical landscapes artwork, I have seen people overjoyed and overwhelmed with it's view and at the same time I'm like ok, it's..ok..lets move on. Clearly there is two completely different approach in how one would see things.
 

Shabby

Junior Member
Sorry if recently I am going on about the recent Agar Aura oils a lot but I am completely in love with them.

They have defined ‘artisan’ for me more than anything else. It is where the soul of the craftsman and the soul of the wood meet.

When I smell the oil, two things come to mind: Taha’s signature and the essence of the wood.

However a signature is not just a style of distillation, it is the worldview of the soul - what do they think is beautiful, how do they see beauty, how do they present that through the raw materials.

When I am smelling the recent hand-cooked oils it feels like a personal conversation between me, Taha and the wood. That is artisanship!

I’m sure similar things can be said for all the vendors to the extent to which their soul is in the work.

@Rai Munir the great man Amanda Coomaraswamy has written profound words about this subject exactly, as has Guenon. Sorry I forgot to say that I am no relative of the former.
 

Rai Munir

Musk Man
Sorry if recently I am going on about the recent Agar Aura oils a lot but I am completely in love with them.

They have defined ‘artisan’ for me more than anything else. It is where the soul of the craftsman and the soul of the wood meet.

When I smell the oil, two things come to mind: Taha’s signature and the essence of the wood.

However a signature is not just a style of distillation, it is the worldview of the soul - what do they think is beautiful, how do they see beauty, how do they present that through the raw materials.

When I am smelling the recent hand-cooked oils it feels like a personal conversation between me, Taha and the wood. That is artisanship!

I’m sure similar things can be said for all the vendors to the extent to which their soul is in the work.

@Rai Munir the great man Amanda Coomaraswamy has written profound words about this subject exactly, as has Guenon. Sorry I forgot to say that I am no relative of the former.
Thanks, my respected and dearest Shabby. "worldview of soul" and then 'what do THEY THINK is beautiful, and HOW do THEY see BEAUTY ... "; it's food for thought, but the bold letters by me in your post have given room to personalistic worldview of the soul, that doesn't remain to be a worldview.

This is I have fully understood that it is the artist who himself gets melted, which is not an easy a task. Respected Shabby, those who distill 'essential oils', can we say they don't cover the journey from a distiller to BE OUD as such? If inference is to be made (which is actually not to be done without your prior permission), Artisanal Oud distillers are actually CREATOR, while essential oil distillers are mechanics.

I haven't acquired any oil directly from Mr Taha , because of certain hurdles on my way.

Yes, great Ananda Coomaraswamy has written on Traditional Art, and great master Rene Guenon (Abd al-Wāḥid Yaḥyá) has discussed it in "East and West" and "The Reign of Quantity and the Signs of Modern Times" in detail. Titus Burckhard's (Ibrahim `Izz-ud-Din) writings on this topic are worth-reading.

Why essential oils on the market cannot compete artisanal oils? Differences are there. Worldview of the soul !

Is there any particular distillation method difference?
Is there any difference in wood to be distilled?
Is there adulteration of/in oils that creates difference?

Suppose I get Assam Oud oil from a renowned essential oil brand, and one from our artisanal oud brands; there is unbridgeable gap between the oils.
 
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Shabby

Junior Member
Dear @Rai Munir your inference is precisely correct. By that perspective the artisan is the vessel by which the distillate is obtained: he is no more than a vessel nor less - he is vicegerent and servant at the same time after all. Seeing and appreciating that unique vessel is a great privilege for me...when I see a name for an oil like 'Syed's Ascent', I will certainly take my time to see how this ascent occurs and why it is felt, but also I would like to know what it means for it to be called 'Syed's Ascent' and not 'Shabby's Ascent'. If it clicks, then that is great joy. And yes, of course trust is the fundamental prerequisite.

The whole question of artisanship is one of intimacy. So the distillation method and the understanding of the difference in wood is more intimate. What I mean by this is that the particular nuances of both the wood and its interplay with the equipment is understood at a more detailed level and applied in a more particular way than a distiller of a generic essential oil.

This is not an absolute distinction of course, but a question of degrees. If I buy an essential oil from White Lotus Aromatics, I am certain that they supply the oil based on a deep knowledge of the various nuances of the oils and the special qualities of whatever oils they are selling. But if asked about the difference between a generic essential oil and an artisan's oil, I would say 'intimacy' and 'particularity', which also goes hand in hand with a smaller scale operation.

By the way I think this article is one of the best I have ever read on a true artisan. I hope you will find it useful or enjoyable: https://www.kyarazen.com/wuyi-cliff-tea-part-3-tea-maker-cannot-helped/
 

Rai Munir

Musk Man
... be called 'Syed's Ascent' and not 'Shabby's Ascent'.
:handok: I got it. 'Maza aagaya parh kei aapka fiqra (Your sentence brought me immense felicity and ecstasy)'.
And yes, of course trust is the fundamental prerequisite.
Can I have the true essence of the oil released by someone with 51 % critical thinking/ mind?

Thanks a lot. I have got a direction now.
 
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