Kyara/Kynam: IS IT REALLY OUD?

Discussion in 'Art and Science of Oud' started by Rai Munir, Sep 25, 2017.

  1. Rai Munir

    Rai Munir Musk Man

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    Kyara/Kynam: IS IT REALLY OUD?

    Since the day I joined certain forums, I have been reading a lot about Kyara/Kynam. Description I have read about the wood and certain oils about it shows it is the best Oud ever found in human history, and we, the twenty first centurians, are the fortunate ones to wear and smell it. Appreciation is almost limitless.

    Certain things keep striking my mind. Of course, collectively made quest to reach some concrete and solid platform, rather than bombastic descriptions of vendors, is what this Forum has blessed us with. Therefore, for my personal knowledge, I would request for the posts regarding certain aspects:

    i. Any reference, authentic and valid, about presence of Kynam/Kyara OIL in/ by Arabs and in the Subcontinent?

    ii. Has kynam/kyara ever been used like Oudwood in Arabian and Asian countries?

    iii. Had kynam/kyara always been included in Oud OIL array? Or has it been very much in culture since the beginning?

    iv. Is kyra/kynam really Oud? Has it some similarity with Oud, the Oud that has been considered Oud since ages, or is it a medicine or some fragrant wood like cedar, etc?

    v. When was kynam/kyara appeared as epitome of Oud, especially OIL? (Burning its wood is a separate topic.)

    vi. Is kynam/kyara considered a that-much-appreciated Oud (if at all it is an oud) in the Subcontinent, especially in India? Or is it considered even an Oud in traditional Oud OIL area-Hind?

    vii. Kynam/ Kyara notes generally described are really Oud notes?

    I hope ‘personal preference’ is not to be considered a yardstick. Above questions are many, but nature is the same.

    I have been thinking on kynam/kyara for a couple of months, but whenever I read the description, I feel I am going to order chunks of candies, not Oud. Whatever vendors say, that is no recommendation at all as a lot of factors are involved active in the back of mind of vendors. Moreover, a chef’s praise for the edibles cooked by him is the weakest thing, especially when vendors are not master distillers.

    There are some other things to be explored. But later, I will post about them. I strongly hope I will benefit from all respectable members.
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2018
  2. hedycent

    hedycent Oud Fan

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    Are you questioning if kinam / kyara is resinated wood from an aquilaria species?
     
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  3. Rai Munir

    Rai Munir Musk Man

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    Respected hedycent, all aspects. Not specifically its being resinated wood.
     
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  4. Ouddict

    Ouddict Technical Support

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    Kinam/Kyara seems to be 99% marketing nowadays.... I’m sure we will hear some new phrases when the effectiveness of these words is lost... i’m guessing things like oleoresin, auxiliary notes, x-axis and other nonsense will be carted out again to the unwary and trusting.
     
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  5. Faizal_p

    Faizal_p Resident Artisan

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    https://www.kyarazen.com/what-is-kyara-or-kynam/

    Please read this brother munir, kinam/ kyara is considered the pinnacle, the epitome of Oud. The wood with its appearance and the aroma are second to none. To make an oil currently is impossible, maybe you can have a few grams of shavings put into the pot. However a full distillation would easily go into the millions, 3ml could cost $10/15k plus.
    There is a remote possibility someone may have distilled kinam in the past but whether something like that would ever come to light...?
    Some oils may exhibit some notes which are present when heating kinam, bitter green almond, piercing sweetness. Therefore you might say it's kinamic however these would just be fleeting shadows of real kinam.
     
  6. F4R1d0uX

    F4R1d0uX Resident Artisan

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  7. Rai Munir

    Rai Munir Musk Man

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    Thanks a lot, brother Faizal. I read the article present at Kyarazen, and some other scattered articles, then I posted here.

    Is it really "the pinnacle"?
    Are its notes really "second to none"?
    It is "currently" impossible, but had the oil been distilled ever in the past?
    Is it really like this "Some oils may exhibit some notes which are present when heating kinam", or vice versa?

    Majority of members have pretty vast exposure; therefore, I want your guidance. At the moment I am skeptical about it.
     
  8. Rai Munir

    Rai Munir Musk Man

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    Brother F4R1douX, stop DE-ACTIVATING me! :(:Cry::Ninja:
     
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  9. F4R1d0uX

    F4R1d0uX Resident Artisan

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    It's a pinacle for a certain culture and for certain people.

    Session are long it's precious as it's rare.

    Maybe your taste maybe not.

    Maybe too expensive to be your taste regarding the quantity you will get maybe you can enjoy more high quality wood with long sessions.

    Did you manage to get a small sample from kyarazen and get an idea of what it really is ?
     
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  10. Rai Munir

    Rai Munir Musk Man

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    @F4R1d0uX : Well, I have collected a bulk of information, but the concern is specifically its attributes that are the hall mark of OUD as such. Had it been"a pinnacle" in Oud Oil wearing cultures, or is it a modern discovery?
    I said that matter of taste is a kind of avoidance. So, I requested for some thing other than taste-ism.
    I could manage, but I said the more I read about its description, the more I convinced it is no oud at all. Just fragrant wood.
     
  11. Ouddict

    Ouddict Technical Support

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    :Roflmao:
     
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  12. Ouddict

    Ouddict Technical Support

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    It’s not a modern discovery, but a certain contemporary vendor abused this word until it became meaningless.
     
  13. Rai Munir

    Rai Munir Musk Man

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    @F4R1d0uX
    Both getting 'kinamic'! Green notes:p:Laugh:
     
  14. F4R1d0uX

    F4R1d0uX Resident Artisan

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    Rarity and the fact that in Chinese culture, possessing kynam makes you something important as it said that it requires more than a life to fall on ky nam, rich people buy it to show that "they are special people" and i respect that.

    It's heavily resinated, sessions are long, its oud and it's a special one.

    Now "concepts", I respect them too and Im quite admirative of good marketing technics as long as they don't fall into lies or speculations transformed in revealed truth.

    As I said to the few clients I have in private : trust your nose and trust your taste.

    I'm not into : client got the power nor client is the king, I'm more like oud consumer is a free (wo)man, free to have the tastes he/she wants.

    Forget about oils, you can get concepts that things can be sold as kynam because it smells kynam or because it comes from a "kynamic area" ect ect.

    I'm not really sure even the most loyal client can build faith in this with a rational approach.

    But at the end of the day, if client happy with it, client is free...
     
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  15. Rai Munir

    Rai Munir Musk Man

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    Thanks and thanks, brother. I learnt it is greatly loved in China or by the Chinese. Clients are happy with all those brands that exist nowhere on Forum when the word synthetic or low grade wood mixed, etc are welded with the products those brands offer. Anyway.
    Of course, all are respected here. This is the distinction of this Forum. I have fully got your valuable views. Thanks, akhi.
     
  16. F4R1d0uX

    F4R1d0uX Resident Artisan

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    Welcome to the modern world in where newbies like me are considered as experts free to influence people ...

    You're the lost welcome respected brother ...
     
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  17. Alkhadra

    Alkhadra "Master Kafeel" Resident Artisan

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    Dear brother Rai Munir,
    Some of the questions you've asked are quite difficult to answer due to the fact that we don't know what average Oud was back in history. Did people only use sinking grade Ouds? I think you get what I mean.

    Now to your questions:
    I. Any reference, authentic and valid, about presence of Kynam/Kyara OIL in/ by Arabs and in the Subcontinent?
    In Arabia, there are some marketing gimmicks that utilize the world Kyara and Kynam, with some oils being called Kyara and Kynam. As for the Subcontinent, although I am fairly certain you can find some references, I haven't yet done the research on it.

    II. Has kynam/kyara ever been used like Oudwood in Arabian and Asian countries?
    As I said earlier, we don't know what average grade Oud was considered back in the day. Oud back then was a lot more abundant, and I am quite sure that much of the high grade Ouds harvested long ago was probably Kyara/Kynam.

    IV. Is kyra/kynam really Oud? Has it some similarity with Oud, the Oud that has been considered Oud since ages, or is it a medicine or some fragrant wood like cedar, etc?
    It should be considered an Oud as it is produced from Oud trees. Regular Oud with hard resin and oil is produced when the tree is infected, and the tree is able to clot the infection, fully killing it off and replacing it with Oud. Oil filled Kyara is produced when the infection is occuring at a rate faster than the tree can heal itself and fight off the infection, causing the formation to become saturated in oil, and soft (Atleast in the vietnamese variety). There are many different ideas on what Kyara/Kynam are.


    I hope this helped, gotta go to a meeting now :Roflmao:
     
  18. Rai Munir

    Rai Munir Musk Man

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    Respected Alkhadra, I am highly grateful to you. Yes, it is helpful. At least I have got some clue. Though certain expressions in your post are difficult to verify and digest. Anyway.

    The most prominent part of the post is "we don't know what average grade Oud was considered back in the day."
     
  19. AbasFrag

    AbasFrag Oud Burner

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    Great activating questions :D

    I tried heating some kyara and I must say I was so dissapointed... I've not tried so many "kinamic" oils to say anything about them. Maybe just oud yusuf?
     
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  20. Alkhadra

    Alkhadra "Master Kafeel" Resident Artisan

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    Sincerest apologies dear Rai Munir, if you can let me know exactly which expressions were difficult/hard to digest? I could expand on them further.
    Thanks!
     

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